iiinova — where your digital self keeps evolving

Replies

TracketPacer @tracketpacer.com · 22/01/2025

we can’t seem to do polls here yet but how many of yall are familiar with the IETF & IEEE? what’s your impression of these groups?

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Trix Farrar @basementtrix.bsky.social · 22/01/2025

I recognize the acronyms and know the names. They set the standards. That's about as far as I go, opinion-wise.

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VESA_Pool_Party @neoncrowresearch.bsky.social · 22/01/2025

The IEEE is basically responsible for the modern world actually working.

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msxenix.bsky.social @msxenix.bsky.social · 22/01/2025

I know of the IEEE standards but know next to nothing about the committee itself or how standards are made.

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Jon Major @jonmajor.bsky.social · 23/01/2025

I'm familiar, but I've heard so many horror stories of people presenting ideas to these groups. Maybe that's IT? But it seems awful lol. Overall though the groups provide a valuable service... With room for improvement.

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fully automated robot orgy @blackwire.work · 22/01/2025

You dare question the old gods? In all seriousness they are needed to keep standards alive and sane, it's a good counter to the software development mindset that just breaks everything

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harbulot.bsky.social @harbulot.bsky.social · 23/01/2025

It's been a while, but I've found that you could quite easily engage in IETF/RFC conversations, e.g. on RFC drafts mailing lists. As long as you made relevant technical points, the main authors had no issues. IEEE seems more like a pay-to-play type of org, understandable, but less welcoming

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sagsde.bsky.social @sagsde.bsky.social · 23/01/2025

They do some very necessary work but i dont have too much experience with them

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Brian Heaton @geekdownrange.bsky.social · 22/01/2025

I think of the IETF operating at the ping/pung layer and above. I think of IEEE operating at the level of wires, antennas, voltages, and frames. When I read IEEE docs I feel like I need a math degree sometimes.

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Lee Ryman @leeryman.bsky.social · 22/01/2025

Don't forget the ANSI, TIA, EIA, IEC and ITU! We wouldn't have 8p8c, cabling, and spectrum for networks to operate over! They all have their different areas of expertise, and seem to work more efficiently together than other organisations. Fill a room with engineers and things get done!

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Ichinin @ichinin.bsky.social · 22/01/2025

IMO, IEEE are basically electrical engineers that suck at cryptography, the nerds at IETF don't.

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Brad Reed @bradreed.bsky.social · 22/01/2025

CWNP exams really like talking about both of them.

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YetAnotherSteve @yaseppochi.bsky.social · 11/02/2025

IETF standardized email! 😢😂😢😂😢😂😢😂😢😂 They’re human, but better-intentioned than most of us. The IETF standards I deal with aren’t intended to create oligopolies that the FTC will overlook rather than oversee, I’ll say that for them too.

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Wouter 🛰️ @pa3weg.nl · 22/01/2025

Aware of both as standardising bodies, engineering societies, "the guys that won't let me download papers" and "this costs HOW MUCH?!" I have always considered most of them too far away from my day to day reality but standards happen and that's great (albeit extremely slow)

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M@ - Elon is a horrible person @mattygx93.bsky.social · 22/01/2025

I’m aware and have read through many docs on SIP, but don’t really have an opinion on them as a group.

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Pete Lumbis @plumbis.bsky.social · 22/01/2025

😴😴😴😴

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referencedesk.bsky.social @referencedesk.bsky.social · 22/01/2025

It's pretty easy for an individual to participate in IETF activities, even purely via online attendance. Even as a noob, I managed to participate in the work leading up to a couple of RFCs.

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NoIQ @noiq15.bsky.social · 22/01/2025

IEEE quietly dropped 802.11 5 and 10 mhz channel bandwidths between 2007 and 2009 and no one seems to have documented the decision.

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Drew Kirkman @drewkirkman.com · 22/01/2025

Both are important, but I think I like the IETF model better. It just seems more altruistic to me

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AJ @goldman60.nclf.net · 24/01/2025

I was an IEEE member for a few years, they do good work but imo the membership wasn't worth it beyond the line item in the resume.

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jig.bsky.social @jig.bsky.social · 22/01/2025

both have a spectrum of members from helpful greybeards to opinionated newbs, and local meetings/events can veer away from helpful, but chill encourages chill. publications wise, they both publish excellent work and standards, broader than pure academic papers. IEEE is probably ~better, pub wise.

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toastedflakes.bsky.social @toastedflakes.bsky.social · 23/01/2025

I’m reasonably familiar with SystemVerilog from IEEE and it does suffer from design by committee. Everyone’s pet feature is in, even if it interacts weirdly with other features. I used to hate it, until I realised most other specifications I dealt with were way worse.

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Tony Bourke @tonybourke.bsky.social · 23/01/2025

Story I heard about Dr Radia Pearlman, creator of the spanning tree protocol: she had an idea to change forwarding so STP wasn’t needed, and she went to the IEEE. They said no, so she went to the IETF, and they said yes and that became TRILL. The IEEE realized it was a good idea and did SPB.

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Chris @ Network Fun-Times @networkfuntimes.bsky.social · 22/01/2025

they're all cowards &and i could easily defeat aNY of them in my dojo of death. (apart from the strong ones, and probably also the medium-strength ones)

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RobertGar @robertgar.bsky.social · 22/01/2025

I'm familiar with both but really don't have an opinion on either.

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Frederik Hansen @handle.invalid · 22/01/2025

I had never heard of IETF before today. But i do also mainly do(study) electrical engineering.

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Frederik Hansen @handle.invalid · 22/01/2025

I TRIPLE E BAAABYYYYY!

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Kal Feher @kalfeher.bsky.social · 22/01/2025

IEEE is a coin operated standards group. IETF is open to anyone to participate. just need email and an opinion. I've written a couple of RFCs and participated in IETF WGs for many years. rewarding and frustrating. If you attend an IETF (highly recommend) be sure to join their new comers groups

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Josh Redmore @jredmore.bsky.social · 23/01/2025

I'm a Sr. member of IEEE and also contribute to IETF. You could say I have favorable impressions of both.

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At Packetlevel @packetlevel2.bsky.social · 22/01/2025

Back in the day, I was lucky enough to get my initial standards training in conferences taught by the individual chairs of the committees. It included great complete information in binders on things like grounding and bonding. Back when a lowly sysadmin could afford it.

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The Syzygysist @starfisher.bsky.social · 23/01/2025

It’s been a while, but I once designed and implemented secure, distributed computing middleware based on IETF Internet Drafts. Later on I was involved in multiple standard orgs. The IETF culture seemed less amenable to “corporate capture” than some others.

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Drew Conry-Murray @drewcm.bsky.social · 22/01/2025

They move slower than we might like, but the work they do has been and continues to be essential to the networking industry.

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Viktor @tautadiction.bsky.social · 22/01/2025

They are both good organizations but very different. The IEEE standards work is really quite different from both the rest of what they do and what IETF does.

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armourmsg.bsky.social @armourmsg.bsky.social · 23/01/2025

Having only worked mostly with IEEE standards: there needs to be more funding and resources given to representatives from companies and diversifying and leveling out those representatives to the committee so certain companies don't have as much weight to throw around.

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nikolai @nikolaiovesen.com · 26/01/2025

Ben cartwright-cox has a pretty good(and entertaining) presentation where he addresses getting an RFC through the IETF: "BGP Send Hold Timer - Addressing stuck routes". I saw him present it at NONOG 6 last year, recording here: benjojo.co.uk/talks/send-h...

benjojo.co.uk

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