iiinova — where your digital self keeps evolving

It feels like good bones. Would be a lower lift to swap HTMX for Datastar. Keep same routes/handlers, but maybe add an app db for driving the app and syncing everything to PDS for durability.

100

Yeah reading this issue makes me think they had the right idea, but not enough experience w/ HTMX or hypermedia to execute confidently (why the issue was never updated). That said I think svelte is great too and excited for a snappier tangled.

010

Basically w/ something like Datastar you have everything you need to leverage the same affordances for immediately acknowledging intent (loading indicator/sekeleton whatever).

000

kanbananza.yagni.club there is one gap w/ the contextual menus of cards that I missed where it waits for round trip before showing the context menu, but I am addressing that.

kanbananza.yagni.club

Kanbananza

100

drk @drk.wtf · 11h

Even with network latency you could provide the same affordances a SPA would as well as mitigate and mask network latency with animations.

120

drk @drk.wtf · 12h

My hunch is there's a lot of going to remote resources for data/writes in hot paths (knots/PDS etc) vs having an app db w/ cached data that syncs to PDS. I haven't looked through the source in a long time though.

Dbugs · Datastar/CQRS edition

drk @drk.wtf · 12h

dbugs.yagni.club everything as a round trip can still be fast. I think HTMX maybe makes it more difficult to do well and likely more to do with the backend architecture.

dbugs.yagni.club

drk @drk.wtf · 17h

*thinks of the scene from Stand by Me*

000

More accurately like endless Christmas movie trailers all playing at the same time.

000

A lot are like the old Guess Who commercials as well. Representing the product in an artificial way. Does the app really do/behave like that? Probably not.

000

I feel like all Opus 5.5 did with motion graphics was seriously degrade their impact and effectiveness. Impressive for sure, but timelines now just look like an endless list of Christmas movie posters. They all kind of feel the same and I end up not want to watch any of them.

200

I see so they're able to start inputting text then the ROOT of the app (JavaScript) is like… no no… I am at the ROOT now!

Captain Philips meme of pirate saying "JavaScript. I am the root now."

000

I heard SPAs are the best way to guide devs in to the pit of success… 🤔

150

Because the patterns haven't been codified yet for a JS runtime. I am working on extracting this all in to a reusable library that any dev/agent using would fall in to a pit of success.

buddy… you're stuck on a gap that happened to be implemented in a way that requires a round trip. You're intentionally ignoring me and being obtuse.

100

*unless you're building local-first. I get that the new Solid model is meant to span the whole spectrum so I don't want to discount that. I have another demo you can nit exploring hypermedia with service workers as well derekr.github.io/datastar-sw-.... Dead end atm, but fun experiment.

derekr.github.io

Datastar SW

000

That's not to say you can't build a lot of the same apps/achieve the same UX with any technology and agree w/ Ryan here wrt to it being more about ergonomics. I just happen to think there's some unexplored ergonomic wins to be had with something like Datastar.

100

I've just implemented enough escape hatches that ultimately involve round trips that I'd rather just work with hypermedia and towards closing the gap there wrt to UX.

100

local-thirst: doing too much

It's not even the megabytes of JS for me, though that's one aspect. Syncing state to the browser. Duplicating business logic. I don't exactly hide exactly what I don't enjoy about them yagni.club/3msjbjhlyrc2g.

yagni.club

Join me on my state-of-the-web therapy session where I breakdown all the baloney involved in working with a SPA architecture.

100

I'd never tell someone to not build their app as a SPA or to not use whatever tech they enjoy working with. I understand the benefits of a SPA, but have personally decided the trade-offs aren't worth it to me.

100

If feels like you're ignoring the nuance here.

100

It doesn't *require* a round trip by default. Even Solid apps have round trips. The kanban demo clearly shows you can interact with the UI without a round trip other than when you're actually persisting data. The context menu is a gap.

300

Not yet. I stopped defaulting to public until I can audit LLM generated code incase it leaks anything sensitive from my system. I'll def ping you when it's available though.

010

Can't speak for an entire community, but what I see is a lot of people tired of all the baggage that comes with most modern day SPA architectures. Datastar to them is likely very refreshing. It is to me at least.

100

Here I am, a part of that community, saying that Solid2 is dope.

100

The demo has gaps for sure that I am working on closing, but you act like one surface that had latency proves a point. Anything we share it's received with nits instead of curiosity.

100

buddy… I'll never change your mind even with a highly interactive demo. You could choose to get curious, but you seem to be very narrow-minded. I think Solid2 is great and there are lots of cool ideas there. We only every try to engage because it feels like hypermedia is misrepresented.

brother very dismissive. It's WIP and nothing prevents me from rendering that without a round trip.

100

This kanban demo was like the least invested in version. Still WIP, but you can build very interactive apps with hypermedia kanbananza.yagni.club/b/LC3W67LTiYDh. dbugs.yagni.club

kanbananza.yagni.club

Board — Kanbananza

200

Ben Croker @bencroker.com · 25/09/2026

brother… very unimaginative! You can get similar ergonomics on the backend w/ JSX. Code abstracted away in reusable web components so more interactive UX can still be provided in a declarative way as well. You app code still stays lean.

100

Reposted by drk

A year ago I presented Datastar at Dot All 2025. I’ve released an edited version with ums and ahs, long pauses and detours removed, and the audio quality significantly improved. The talk content seems just as relevant today as it was back then. www.youtube.com/watch?v=48M7...

youtube.com

Real-Time Collaboration with Sprig and Datastar [Edited]

YouTube video by Datastar

042

drk @drk.wtf · 25/09/2026

So play around with it. Let me know what I am getting wrong. I might fix it.

010

drk @drk.wtf · 24/09/2026

Frontier lab ships slop. Addresses with more slop. Can your team afford this cycle indefinitely? All I see in this article is waste and toxic positivity.

001

Reposted by drk

Ben Croker @bencroker.com · 21/09/2026

Rocket, Datastar’s answer to web components, is now free for all 🚀 www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhCm...

youtube.com

Rocket reaches escape velocity

YouTube video by Datastar

1123

Reposted by drk

Matt Hodges @matthodges.bsky.social · 19/09/2026

Very quick and dirty Jev test for hiring bias. One resume for a Wall Street job; asked whether the applicant should get a first-round interview. 76 evaluations, changing only the first name. 19 of each: White-associated men/women, Black-associated men/women. console.typesafe.ai/playground?s...

19475116

Reposted by drk

Datastar Cult Leader @data-star.dev · 18/09/2026

It's faster to load a designobo project view, with 7 iframes, than to start a electron app. The entire client side js, including datastar, is 30kb gzipped!! youtu.be/I1u9f9X8h-g?...

youtu.be

datastar is indeed pretty good

YouTube video by Guillem Garcia

051

Maybe they worked while offline, but then what? This was a 24hr demo by a good eng who was trying to help contribute as close as possible hypermedia parity.

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kanban-solidstart-lf9jejx7v-loren-stewarts-projects.vercel.app

Tbf w/ the kanban demo I don't think the other's handle offline sync either kanban-solidstart-lf9jejx7v-loren-stewarts-projects.vercel.app. They aren't even available anymore!

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Many successful businesses built with SPA in the wild… especially Sentry even though I have my complaints haha.

000

That said there's definitely a class of app that is better suited for SPA/local-first/offline. I am also a fan of the experiments and emerging solutions in the space. Even try out my own approaches derekr.github.io/datastar-sw-.... I just wouldn't build a business on it personally.

derekr.github.io

Datastar SW

100

At the end of the day the most reliable UX I've had is manually downloading/caching the resources like local maps. Often times better served by a native app with more reliable storage characteristics than what most mobile browser offer.

100

And not convinced SPA apps with full offline support are simple to operate, manage or debug. I still haven't reliably used an offline web app in any scenario where I have zero internet.

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Like I have perfect internet connection and I can't go investigate errors/alerts because the app won't boot.

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For sure and I am not trying to tell you or anyone not to build with SPAs. Lots of practical reasons to go with them, but to your point they tend to be the default these days to the detriment to well anyone that uses a critical app like my mortgage website or my observability platform 🤣.

100